Various suggestions

[WinkouS3]

Hello, here's some suggestions we thought about, please comment to them and give some feedback.

• EXP Wise changes :

Level 1 - 100 : No changes needed except one : make the skeleton soldiers + warriors turn orange earlier (around 70s) and make the ssc quest (200 skeletons kills) start as the same time soldiers turn orange.

Leveling to 100 needs to be really easy solo, leveling past 100 should be more of a group thing rather than doable in 1 day to 240 solo. 

=> Nerf every solo leveling place in the game such as East Ladianes or egg in V1/V2 (doesn't need to be hard nerf but at least make the next places - which are more group thing - really viable versus those places) :

Level 100 - 120 : Rampao dungeon instance

Level 120 - 160 : SSC

Level 160 - 200 : Rock Island

Level 200 - 240 : Rampao temple 1

Level 240 - 280 : Rampao temple 2 => Delete the need of ladianes grace to enter it or make it a TC Item

Level 280 - 350 : Frozenland

Level 280 - 350 : Hau

Level 300 - 350 : Catastropha Cavern + Catastropha room

Leveling to 300 is currently doable solo and in a group, the problem is in both situations it's the same places visited (V3 mostly to 275 and then some FL/Hau/V4).

SSC is never visited (for leveling purpose), RT1 as well and RT2 requires too much farm beforehand (ladianes graces are a real pain). These places need a buff in term of experience so then you can easily grind your way through group instances (not nation based) up to 280 which is a really good level to start competing versus 300s.

Start nation events at level 280 instead of level 200, make the two places Frozenland and Hau harder and also giving better rewards (mostly in terms of experience).

Current main problem is : it's harder (but not that hard) to get 300 than 350. Moreover content in 350 is not interesting enough to make people go 350.

Make level 300 definitely reachable with new FL and Hau starting at 280 but make 350 the real challenge (reward players 350 in ways explained below).

In order to level up to 350, 300 players should take advantage of both FL and Hau everytime it happens and most importantly the catastropha cavern.

Catastropha cavern and room should be giving way better experience than the 2 other places.

Delete the experience given by the Catastropha Island, it should be seen as a Rue+GC combined island and not leveling zone.

Increase drop rate of G12 jewelry in the cavern, not on little monsters but make Boss drop 3 pieces on drop scroll just like V3 : 1 piece of each G12 jewelry part.

If you give interests to 350 on getting Hau island, Frozenland, cavern and also catastropha island, people won't regret getting 301 and quit the next days following.

• Gear Wise changes :

It's not so much of a gear problem but mostly a pvp problem and a little bit of pve problem :

Currently you get to 270+ and then you usually decide to go for the crafter :

 There's no need to repeat how bad the current unlock craft system is.

Once your crafter is done u craft a piece of each items of your set let's take example of RM who's crafting ablaze boots helmet 2x vambs and the rm gets them to 10/10 boom it's already better than a +8 G11 ultima set (getting a 10/10 set is...... really really really easy ? getting a +8 g11 is.... way not so easy !). Then the rm crafts a staff for fun and eventually gets a 12/10 msa ma one which is k for a start but barely like a +8 one (with red touch ok).

Now he hops to rue island, face 5 people and actually tank them all ezpz but they also tank him ezpz with their 10/10 sets.

Basically in a hour of farm, this redmage achieved the defense values we used to get after hundreds of hours of farms for g11 +8 sets during OB and such but his ap is not good at all. And this will even get worse once he'll achieve his 16/14 set or so with a 18/12 wep (an equivalent of like +10 G11 set with not even +10 G11 weapon ap wise).

Press "I" see over 750 relative pdef, over 740 relative mdef, 10k ap.

The problem in all this is not the AP, it's the defense because u could add thousands of ap on a staff it wouldn't change a thing versus like a 16 dam fist set wearing a valk prot (over 1k DAM), first of all until u get red touch on him, you'll hit 0 !!

I can agree for physicals if an archer shows up you're back to +8 g11 pdef values due to the bow debuff but then that means there's a class which u can't pvp without. A class which already is - legit - the best class in any aspect of the game : pvp, pve, utility.............

If you watch a youtube video of pvp like 2 years old or something, you'll only find 1v10 videos because this is why we play TB. We don't play TB to be forced playing full vit archer and spam scatter shots left and right.

So here's the suggestion :

Rework the Archer aplite bow effect to some giving like critical hit rate or attack speed...

Hardnerf the defense and defense against magic values of G12 items

Nerf the defense and defense against magic values of G11 items

=> A good example would be a 14 / 14 pdef mdef part = +8 G11 (classic G11 not nerfed one)

=> New +8 G11 would be close to current +7 G11

And then make it scale so like a 20/20 part becomes a +10 G11 part or something...

Then we can kill eachother in PVP without needing any class and most importantly, heavy farm gets rewarded with winning 1v10 situations.

Moreover if G12 gets nerfed, this gives a purpose to Vice armors, we've been using +9 and even +10 vice parts, still not worth the effort of making them versus like 16 G12 sets. So if G12 gets nerfed, Vice would be more interesting.

The values for G11 and G12 need to be really thought through i was just giving random exemples.

Concerning mana weapons, it's currently impossible for a redmage to tank like a mana gauntlet : I'm playing a 350 redmage, if i wear a full ablaze set i become vulnerable to physical but i'm supposed to escape mana drain and still with mental command level 0 i really can't outpot a mana gauntlet => i'm dieing to 2x 300 players one using the mana gauntlet and the other using like scatter shot or something.

• Quality of life changes :

=> Reward level 300 with crafting G12 unlocked (still need to level the skills to get reforging tho)

=> Create a Pouch into supreme trader : 10 pouch of a kind + a certain amount of leni for a supreme gem of a kind. Standing in V2 to burn rh, bt or standing still in front a g6 npc vendor to burn seph is NOOOOOOT FUN. It would also give more values to Leni. Consider this suggestion you're really the only one saying this would devalue the supreme gem @shockdot please come online and burn my 120 seph gem pouches, if you're good it takes you around 9 min for a supreme so that's just 1h48 of standing still in front of a npc

=> Give us the possibility of creating not 5 but 10...20...50 maybe warehouses per side instead of those disappointed and 1h crowded 5 whs forcing us to make more alts than real characters (legit the game has more alt chars than real ones).

=> Create % mana potions.

=> Make mix gems a stackable item

=> Delete G11 jewelry from the V4 Crate drop table. If u want G11 jewelry you just go V3 kill a few mobs or even a boss, disappointing of getting a G11 jewelry (in one sample) in a higher level bracket zone.

=> Make V3 and V4 give Pk points on server 1 (and also soulshards if it currently doesn't).

=> Make every bracket of soccer start with a 1 like 1-160 161-200 201-300 301-350.

=> Reduce Duan guardian pool of HP.

=> Show at the end of the stat of an item the % chance it goes 1 level higher. Like Physical Skill Attack Lv.8 (60%) 60% would be the chance of going +9.

Thanks for reading.

Dj

[shockdot]

10 hours ago, WinkouS3 said:

Hello, here's some suggestions we thought about, please comment to them and give some feedback.

• EXP Wise changes :

Level 1 - 100 : No changes needed except one : make the skeleton soldiers + warriors turn orange earlier (around 70s) and make the ssc quest (200 skeletons kills) start as the same time soldiers turn orange.

Leveling to 100 needs to be really easy solo, leveling past 100 should be more of a group thing rather than doable in 1 day to 240 solo. 

=> Nerf every solo leveling place in the game such as East Ladianes or egg in V1/V2 (doesn't need to be hard nerf but at least make the next places - which are more group thing - really viable versus those places) :

Level 100 - 120 : Rampao dungeon instance

Level 120 - 160 : SSC

Level 160 - 200 : Rock Island

Level 200 - 240 : Rampao temple 1

Level 240 - 280 : Rampao temple 2 => Delete the need of ladianes grace to enter it or make it a TC Item

Level 280 - 350 : Frozenland

Level 280 - 350 : Hau

Level 300 - 350 : Catastropha Cavern + Catastropha room

Leveling to 300 is currently doable solo and in a group, the problem is in both situations it's the same places visited (V3 mostly to 275 and then some FL/Hau/V4).

SSC is never visited (for leveling purpose), RT1 as well and RT2 requires too much farm beforehand (ladianes graces are a real pain). These places need a buff in term of experience so then you can easily grind your way through group instances (not nation based) up to 280 which is a really good level to start competing versus 300s.

Start nation events at level 280 instead of level 200, make the two places Frozenland and Hau harder and also giving better rewards (mostly in terms of experience).

Current main problem is : it's harder (but not that hard) to get 300 than 350. Moreover content in 350 is not interesting enough to make people go 350.

Make level 300 definitely reachable with new FL and Hau starting at 280 but make 350 the real challenge (reward players 350 in ways explained below).

In order to level up to 350, 300 players should take advantage of both FL and Hau everytime it happens and most importantly the catastropha cavern.

Catastropha cavern and room should be giving way better experience than the 2 other places.

Delete the experience given by the Catastropha Island, it should be seen as a Rue+GC combined island and not leveling zone.

Increase drop rate of G12 jewelry in the cavern, not on little monsters but make Boss drop 3 pieces on drop scroll just like V3 : 1 piece of each G12 jewelry part.

If you give interests to 350 on getting Hau island, Frozenland, cavern and also catastropha island, people won't regret getting 301 and quit the next days following.

• Gear Wise changes :

It's not so much of a gear problem but mostly a pvp problem and a little bit of pve problem :

Currently you get to 270+ and then you usually decide to go for the crafter :

 There's no need to repeat how bad the current unlock craft system is.

Once your crafter is done u craft a piece of each items of your set let's take example of RM who's crafting ablaze boots helmet 2x vambs and the rm gets them to 10/10 boom it's already better than a +8 G11 ultima set (getting a 10/10 set is...... really really really easy ? getting a +8 g11 is.... way not so easy !). Then the rm crafts a staff for fun and eventually gets a 12/10 msa ma one which is k for a start but barely like a +8 one (with red touch ok).

Now he hops to rue island, face 5 people and actually tank them all ezpz but they also tank him ezpz with their 10/10 sets.

Basically in a hour of farm, this redmage achieved the defense values we used to get after hundreds of hours of farms for g11 +8 sets during OB and such but his ap is not good at all. And this will even get worse once he'll achieve his 16/14 set or so with a 18/12 wep (an equivalent of like +10 G11 set with not even +10 G11 weapon ap wise).

Press "I" see over 750 relative pdef, over 740 relative mdef, 10k ap.

The problem in all this is not the AP, it's the defense because u could add thousands of ap on a staff it wouldn't change a thing versus like a 16 dam fist set wearing a valk prot (over 1k DAM), first of all until u get red touch on him, you'll hit 0 !!

I can agree for physicals if an archer shows up you're back to +8 g11 pdef values due to the bow debuff but then that means there's a class which u can't pvp without. A class which already is - legit - the best class in any aspect of the game : pvp, pve, utility.............

If you watch a youtube video of pvp like 2 years old or something, you'll only find 1v10 videos because this is why we play TB. We don't play TB to be forced playing full vit archer and spam scatter shots left and right.

So here's the suggestion :

Rework the Archer aplite bow effect to some giving like critical hit rate or attack speed...

Hardnerf the defense and defense against magic values of G12 items

Nerf the defense and defense against magic values of G11 items

=> A good example would be a 14 / 14 pdef mdef part = +8 G11 (classic G11 not nerfed one)

=> New +8 G11 would be close to current +7 G11

And then make it scale so like a 20/20 part becomes a +10 G11 part or something...

Then we can kill eachother in PVP without needing any class and most importantly, heavy farm gets rewarded with winning 1v10 situations.

Moreover if G12 gets nerfed, this gives a purpose to Vice armors, we've been using +9 and even +10 vice parts, still not worth the effort of making them versus like 16 G12 sets. So if G12 gets nerfed, Vice would be more interesting.

The values for G11 and G12 need to be really thought through i was just giving random exemples.

Concerning mana weapons, it's currently impossible for a redmage to tank like a mana gauntlet : I'm playing a 350 redmage, if i wear a full ablaze set i become vulnerable to physical but i'm supposed to escape mana drain and still with mental command level 0 i really can't outpot a mana gauntlet => i'm dieing to 2x 300 players one using the mana gauntlet and the other using like scatter shot or something.

• Quality of life changes :

=> Reward level 300 with crafting G12 unlocked (still need to level the skills to get reforging tho)

=> Create a Pouch into supreme trader : 10 pouch of a kind + a certain amount of leni for a supreme gem of a kind. Standing in V2 to burn rh, bt or standing still in front a g6 npc vendor to burn seph is NOOOOOOT FUN. It would also give more values to Leni. Consider this suggestion you're really the only one saying this would devalue the supreme gem @shockdot please come online and burn my 120 seph gem pouches, if you're good it takes you around 9 min for a supreme so that's just 1h48 of standing still in front of a npc

=> Give us the possibility of creating not 5 but 10...20...50 maybe warehouses per side instead of those disappointed and 1h crowded 5 whs forcing us to make more alts than real characters (legit the game has more alt chars than real ones).

=> Create % mana potions.

=> Make mix gems a stackable item

=> Delete G11 jewelry from the V4 Crate drop table. If u want G11 jewelry you just go V3 kill a few mobs or even a boss, disappointing of getting a G11 jewelry (in one sample) in a higher level bracket zone.

=> Make V3 and V4 give Pk points on server 1 (and also soulshards if it currently doesn't).

=> Make every bracket of soccer start with a 1 like 1-160 161-200 201-300 301-350.

=> Reduce Duan guardian pool of HP.

=> Show at the end of the stat of an item the % chance it goes 1 level higher. Like Physical Skill Attack Lv.8 (60%) 60% would be the chance of going +9.

Thanks for reading.

Dj

 

EXP Changes

• If enough people show interest in this, we could make these changes for the next season, or similar changes. However, I wouldn't implement exp changes on this level mid season.

 

Equipment Changes

• I've mentioned on the Discord I like the idea of stats granting Mana Steal/Stun Values and/or rates. I'd like to see more support for the idea though.
• I've made a topic in the past regarding the G11 & G12 defense values & why they should be reduced. However, at the time there wasn't much support for the idea (although that appears to have changed). Most people simply said increase the AP of G12 (which you correctly noted wouldn't solve the underlying issue of high % def). I'm for this idea & it could happen this season.
• In terms of Vice Armor, Vice equipment is NOT meant to replace G12 or even G11 equipment. It's strictly meant as a PvE item for Catastropha Cavern & the occasional PvP sessions in said areas. Mind you, everyone would be wearing the same general type of equipment. This is also why the upgrade rate is much easier and why you can make a +9 or +10 piece of it with ease. The one exception is the Enhanced Vice weapons, which I believe have the potential to become as good or close to as good depending on the class as a +10 G11, but made much easier.

 

Quality of Life Changes

• G12 equipment unlocks are tied to the crafting skills because that is an added incentive to level those skills up, not just Reforging unlock. It also makes sense that crafting be tied to these skills (or at least refining & blacksmithing)... The issue is that players from the very start have been leveling one character in groups for crafting skills... This is not how the skill was ever intended to work. I could be convinced I guess to make this change, but I would rather not. Instead I'd like to make this change...
  • Make all non-g12 raw materials not able to be traded (prevents stock piling a single character with materials...).
  • Make leveling up these skills much easier. (The current rates take into account the fact that everyone shares materials onto one character... a change made after it's initial release).
  • Adjust drop quantities & areas.
  • Now this change would make everyone want to level up their own skills as it's much easier, but works more as a solo project for your own character. This change would also prevent players who are botting materials from profiting prior to being banned.
  • Thoughts?
• The idea of converting a certain amount of pouches and leni into a supreme gem is interesting... However, as I stated on discord my fear is that it will make creating these gems much easier than it currently is & could lead to players just stock piling pouches and not upgrading properly... The idea behind supreme gems and fantastic gems were & are to give failed upgrade attempts meaning. Which they do perfectly well now. I could consider this idea. However, the quantity of pouches & leni required would need to be tested against average gem uses per supreme gem & equipment breaks.
• I wouldn't mind increasing total warehouse slots in general, and then adding an additional amount to subscription based users. I wouldn't increase it to anywhere near 50... This change that would require a restructuring of how WH's are saved. (More work than you would think)
  • I would like to unify Warehouses (no difference between Veros or Ladianes Warehouses... they are the same warehouses).
  • Normal warehouses would become 20 storage's.
  • Subscribed warehouses would become 30 storage's.
• I don't mind adding % mana potions, but my concern is the value of said %'s combined with large mana pools.
• I don't mind making mix gems stackable.
• Drops aren't always the best drops, having G11 jewls in there beats getting nothing.
• V3 & V4 are PvE areas, rather they are intended to be. However, I wouldn't mind making this change for server 1.
• As of right now, the Soccer Event is there to help players gear up. While players who are already geared up can and are welcome to participate... The idea is that players have two chances to win if they are the right level (even if that means walking in and getting the lucky last hit). I would have to see support for making every bracket of soccer start with a 1.
• I wasn't aware the Duan Guardian had a large HP pool, I'll look into it.
• We've always kept upgrade rates hidden from players. I'm not entirely against this idea though, and to be honest when I made the safe rates show... I considered it.

 

 

To sum up, EXP changes would not happen until next season. Some of the item & QoL changes could happen this season, in between seasons, or at the start of next season. Some of these require player feedback... So I suggest sharing this topic on the discord, in game, with others, etc.

[WinkouS3]

The idea between Vice being comparable to G11 or G12 was only about Catastropha Cavern. Even with the increase you gave on those items (1,2% per level) I feel like I need to achieve a complete +10 vice set to compete with my G12 set (in the cavern against vice monsters), set not including weapon because the 10 vice staff is definitely stronger than even a maxed g12 staff.

So yeah with G11 and G12 nerf, Vice armor parts become instantly usable in the cavern.

To be honest i've never been a fan of making 1 character crafter for the whole tribe... id rather have my own main character be able to craft. So i'm +100000 your idea.

The idea behind % mana potions is actually to give a reason to large mana pool. I'm never leveling my master skill mental command due to threat of mana steal + anyway i'm using mana saver when i'm like farming. To be honest u only need a perfect balance of 60% mana 40% hp to fit with the mana barrier. Otherwise you're spending most of your potions for your mana pool... % mana would be such improvement for mages. Would also give a reason to hosan for mages.

Dj

Edited June 9, 2019 by WinkouS3
Added an idea